Daniel Kanu

Chief Frank Kokori is a firebrand activist and former secretary-general of the National Union of Petroleum and Natural Gas Workers (NUPENG). He is one known to always speak his mind no matter whose ox is gored. 

As a Board of Trustee member of the All Progressive Congress (APC) he  once took a swipe at the party and the presidency on how not to run a party.

Kokori who has won numerous awards from every credible labour federation in the world, including America’s George Meany Award told Sunday Sun that it is sad Nigerians have become docile, while pointing at the failure of leadership as the bane of the nation’s backwardness.

In this no-holds-barred interview, Kokori spoke on many sensitive national issues including the Edo election, Igbo presidency and how it can be realised, security challenges and the way forward for Nigeria, among others. Excerpt:

 

Are you worried about the development in Edo State as concerns the governorship election which is coming up in September?

Worried as how?

There is this perception that it will be violent, bloody?

Why should I be worried? They will go to the election and this type of election is usually very good, it is different from when the whole 36 states are having the election at the same time. Those elections are not properly monitored and they rig them the way they like. But this one, every ward will be heavily monitored. This is because when an election comes off the normal season and if it is controversial like this Edo case, every unit, every ward will be monitored by more than 20 people, the civil society, media, party agents, security agents, international observers, etc and the true winner will emerge. This one that they are saying that they will kill people,  they won’t kill anybody and Edo is so lucky they don’t have riverine areas, so the right person will win. I am a chieftain of the All Progressives Congress (APC), I still belong to the Board of Trustees even though nobody calls a meeting. I believe the APC will win and I don’t have any much problem about it.

How do you feel that the governor (Obaseki) and his godfather (Adams Oshiomhole) could not resolve their political issues despite all known interventions?

Well, their disagreement could not be settled which is sad. You know we don’t have political parties in Nigeria. The Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) was so bad that some of us did not even touch it with a long pole, so when the APC came we thought it was going to be magnificent, but we have found out that APC is simply not being run well also. It is not as attractive as we thought. I am a member of the Board of Trustees, we were appointed in 2014. I was the only person who I can say was a non-institutional person who was picked by popularity, but ask me how many times have we held meetings? How can a party since 2014, seven years now you can’t understand what is happening there (in the Board of Trustees), Is that a serious party? The few running it simply oppress people, did you not follow my case with Chris Ngige (Labour Minister) the oppression and all that. So, we don’t have political parties in Nigeria, if you are lucky you become a governor, senator, etc you are lucky and that is it. In Nigerian politics once you win that is it, you are lucky; you will go and enjoy your position, other people nobody thinks about them. So, as for Obaseki and Adams, that’s their own business. Adams when he was carrying Obaseki along I cautioned that they should give them level playing ground and that he should stop carrying Obaseki on his head. He carried Obaseki on his head, smashed everything to make Obaseki win, so I thought both of them will work together fine, so I was surprised by the development. But Obaseki has his fault, especially his refusal to inaugurate the entire members of the House. You are a governor, all the whole people (Assembly) are APC, you went in the mid-night, called some people to inaugurate, you left the rest. Even the president of the country called you to inaugurate them, the senate called you to inaugurate them, other important dignitaries called you telling you to inaugurate those 14 people and he refused. I do have soft spot for him (Obaseki), but he got that decision wrong. Well, it is an issue that I don’t want to discuss publicly.

But the court supported Governor Obaseki’s action?

Nigerian court? (laughs) Our judiciary? The judiciary is one of the problems we have in this country. elections are bought in this country and the judiciary is one of our problems and the police force. If those two institutions are okay, Nigeria will just fly. There is so much corruption in the Nigerian judiciary and the police force and these are the two institutions that hold a country. When the police can’t protect you, when the judiciary can’t protect you unless you have money to buy judgment, to buy everything. It is sad that we no longer have a judiciary, one that you will be proud of. That judiciary that prides itself as the last hope of the masses is no longer there. All that ended with the Eshos, Udo Udomas, Oputas etc. The ones we have now are all billionaires. There is no justice in Nigeria again, forget what you hear and that is worrisome.

Still concerning the Edo election, don’t you think that it will be so militarised to an extent that the people, the electorate will be scared to come out to vote?     

The truth is that it is when you militarise the election that people come out to vote.  If there is no police, no army etc, they will kill you there. The ordinary thugs will come out with their guns and machetes to drive voters out of the polling booths. As I am talking to you now I am in the village, here is not Lagos,  but even in Lagos if there are police and army people will not be afraid. The police and the army protect the people on election days (some may compromise, no doubt), but we need those securities especially the army, they will stand far away, without their presence thugs will come to scatter the boxes and to even carry them away. They use anything to win elections in Nigeria. Elections are only fair, a little bit in Nigeria in the Yoruba West, particularly Lagos or in Abuja. You don’t have elections in the South-south and in the Southeast, they are all rigged. If they bring a man from Katsina to Delta, my own state, they will bribe him with an amount that he has never dreamt of, the amount you cannot resist, he will take it and he will forget his brother Buhari, in the North nobody, will give you such money. They are lucky in Edo State the better candidate will win, they can’t rig it because security will be enough to protect voters, voters will come out because they will not be afraid knowing full well that they are protected and that many observers are on the ground watching.

Do you have confidence in the electoral umpire, INEC?

Of course, INEC will deliver. People do bribe INEC, we know, but in a case or situation like this when the entire world is watching they will be careful about what they do. You know the people they use to bribe in INEC are all those returning officers in isolated areas not in the township. You can’t bribe INEC in Lagos, it will be a waste because everybody is looking at you, everybody is watching, monitoring the election. They don’t use much money to win election in Lagos when compared to what happens in the South-south or the Southeast. In Lagos, for instance, people just vote for the party they don’t even know the people they are voting for. But in our villages over here, they bribe everybody unless this type of election now (Edo election) they can’t bribe anybody, unless you want to waste your money, it will be very free and fair, you will see. All these ones they are threatening people is a lie, that day you will see that those threatening violence, fire, and brimstone will not come out to carry any gun because the army, police etc, will be there and they are always serious in such elections because all eyes are watching, they know the eye of the international community will be on them, the civil society, the press will be on them, so they will behave.

What is your take on the security challenge in the country?

That one is a shame to the government and nobody can convince me that Buhari cannot maintain security in the country, it is just that, I don’t know, maybe because of health reasons, but most importantly the Nigerian military is letting everybody down, the whole thing boils down to corruption, they don’t want the war to end. We are so corrupt. I thought that if Buhari goes in within three years Boko Haram will be a thing of the past, but how many years now, more than five years there is still Boko Haram, they are even going everywhere now. Nigeria is not properly governed; I think the whole thing is that the corruption in this country is too much that people like us feel ashamed that God created us in this country. We grew up in a good Nigeria, you know that I am not a small boy, I am an old man, I grew up in colonial time, I knew what Nigeria was then, I was born in the 40s, I am going to 77, I saw everything in this country. in those days when you are looking for a job, you only need to go and sit for the interview, you will get a job with your school certificate. When you now get your university degree the sky is your limit, jobs are everywhere waiting. Now, people are talking of billions, billions and you go to the village some people don’t even have N500 with their wives and children in the house and one person will be counting billions. How did the person get the billions, is it hard work?

But the government is always saying they are on top of security situation?

Forget that, they are not on top of anything. When everywhere is so corrupt like this how can they say they are on top of the situation? Do you know how many Nigerians are being killed each passing day? How many that are kidnapped and the level of banditry going on?

What is your take on the issue of the rotational presidency and the North insisting to hold on to power in 2023?  Do you have a preference for any zone?

Zoning has become something in Nigeria that must remain because we have not developed politically like advanced countries like the United States or Britain, where you talk about talent, a man who is talented, qualified and capable, but Nigeria has not reached that stage, everybody wants their people to be there, so they are always willing to rig it. But by merit and you are talking about democracy and number, the North will always be there despite the fact that there are useless votes from the North, which are not real votes, just like in our South-south here. In our riverine areas, those votes are no votes, like in Delta, Bayelsa etc, they will just come up with one million votes, it’s a lie. There are no one million votes inside these riverine areas. They don’t even have a population there, but they will write one million, and that is also as they do in Sokoto and Kano etc, they just come up with some rubbish figures. The electoral process in Nigeria is not yet clean, so if you say you want to use merit the North as it stands now will have it forever and it won’t come to the South. So, the idea of rotation is good, it goes to the North, it comes to the South.

The Southeast is making a strong case for it for 2023?

All those cases that they are making, for me, you think the people in the North will just say okay, let it go to the Southeast? That means that you are not being realistic or telling yourself the truth. If you want the presidency of Nigeria, be in the right party. Let the PDP give their ticket to the Southeast because it is the party Ndigbo has been voting for. Why can’t they give the ticket to the Southeast? The late Dr. Alex Ekwueme should have been president a long time ago, but when they go to any convention they will sidetrack him. When I came out of prison in 1998 Ekwueme was on top when they were forming the PDP, but you ask, how did they treat him? Was it not a conspiracy against him? Neither the North nor the Yoruba will say oh give or leave it to the Igbo, who will do that in politics? You have to play the right politics; you have to station yourself properly. The Igbo should fight to get a nomination. If you go to a convention you (Ndigbo) must try to win or get the nomination of the party ticket. There is no other way. In today’s Nigeria, if you cannot win the PDP or APC ticket, forget it because these are the only two-party through which the president can emerge. It will be difficult for an Igbo to win APC nomination because they are not APC, the Igbo just like the South-south, are PDP and if it is so they must fight to get the PDP ticket, afterall all their governors are PDP. When they now get the PDP ticket they can start from there to engage others, building the needed political bridges and all that. If you think anybody should say; come and take, that is a dream. Ohanaeze Ndigbo is not a political party, Arewa Consultative Forum is not a political party etc, the political parties are APC and PDP and APGA, but APGA has shown it cannot go beyond Anambra State, a one-state party, which makes it regional. When Emeka Ojukwu was alive we thought he could get the entire East in APGA, but he could not.  If the truth must be told the Igbo can only get the president through the PDP because that is where they belong. All those ones in the APC: Chris Ngige, Ogbonnaya Onu, Geoffrey Onyema etc, are just lucky because when they (APC) were looking for the Igbo to join APC they were reluctant, so those few that came they gave all of them post.  The Igbo believed so much in President Goodluck Jonathan, but Jonathan was so weak that he could not influence anything for them. So, that is what killed them, if not the Igbo deserve to be president. Me, that is telling you this, in Lagos in those days, the chairmen of Surulere local government, Mainland, Ajegunle, etc the Igbo were everywhere, they were taking all the positions. They were almost equal with the Yoruba in running Lagos in those days.

Where do you think that the Igbo missed it?

I can’t say I know, but I think it’s a wrong party. Dr. Alex Ekwueme was their best chance then, he was so qualified, he formed the party (PDP), he did everything, but why should they double-cross him? I don’t know and his own people too helped to double-cross him. If not Ekwueme should have been the president instead of Obasanjo.  I came out from prison the same day with Obasanjo, then I think Ekwueme, the 34 of them have formed the PDP and Ekwueme was at the top of it, suddenly the Generals just met and they deceived the people with money, they deceived the Igbo people again, Jim Nwobodo and his likes, and others they deceived them. For now, I only pray for the Igbo if they can get it, fine.

When you reflect then and now concerning labour how do you feel because many believe that labour is no longer vibrant as it used to be but weak?

Labour, judiciary, including the media etc, every institution in Nigeria today is monetized and that is a problem. Labour is no longer as it was in my time when we fought with our blood. Media of those days, I remember June 12 and what the media did. They will close The Guardian, close The Punch, name them and they will still go underground to print papers. Then the media was the media, vibrant, labour was labour forthright and committed to the masses welfare, the judiciary was still okay, but now bad leadership has destroyed the whole country. If labour and media combine their effort together who is that dictator that they cannot remove? It is labour who will stop the country, they are the ones who can organise big rallies of the masses and the press will be bold to write truth to power and they will change anything in a country, but now even Comrades don’t trust one another.

There is this clamour for the restructuring of the country. Do you share in such a view?

It is because of the injustice in the system. The governors are not doing well; the presidents are not doing well. If everybody is doing well there will be no talk about restructuring. Where are the local governments? They are not doing anything. You just vote money for local government, what do they do, nothing. They just pay their staff, nothing more; they can’t even make a culvert. The whole thing boils down to leadership. Let me tell you, I am not an Igbo man, but there are few people in Nigeria that I know that if you give them this position (President) in the East, a person like Peter Obi, he won’t be tribalistic, Peter Obi can rule this country, we are not friends, but I have got some close experience with him. Look at what he did in Anambra and he left a lot of money with the successor (Willie Obiano) to continue with the development of the state. This is a few of the good people that we have and you can’t change them. Peter Obi is a good man, simple, focused, he demystified power. I also trust Okwesilieze Nwodo and there are few others. There are some good people in this country, they are everywhere, in the North, South, Middle Belt etc, that I know personally that can do something, I just mentioned the Igbo, others abound in other places.

What is the way forward for Nigeria?

It’s sad Nigerians don’t vote for competence again like in the days of NCNC, Action Group, UPN, GNPP etc, they vote for money nowadays. In the rural areas today if somebody gives them rice, N500, or even N200 they will vote for the person, but the person must belong to the two big parties (APC or PDP) and you must mobilise. Small parties have no future in Nigeria the way we are going and I am not even in support of small parties. They just use their political platform to bargain with a strong candidate to give them money, not that they want to win any election. Have you not been following elections? Have they been winning anything? One of the greatest things that Ibrahim Babangida did no matter his sins was the formation of two political parties, SDP and NRC. I was the National Financial Secretary of the SDP.  Nigeria needs two-party system if we must move forward politically.  You can’t push Nigerians on the street like what is happening in some other countries now, like in Belarus, Bagdad, Venezuela, all those things can’t happen in Nigeria now, Nigerians are docile people. Do not say I am calling for revolution because Nigerians now are afraid of revolution. When I was in NUPENG I can talk about it because I know that my people will support me. Then many people didn’t know M.K.O Abiola, but they fought for democracy and that was the spirit then. We have a big government and a small resource, when you now use 75 per cent as recurrent nothing is left for capital expenditure, so what type of country is that? When you use all your money for recurrent and you borrowed the money, what magic do you need for any genuine change or transformation, what do you expect?